M J Designs - advice please

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 1:49 pm

Hi,
I hope it is not too controversial to mention a specific company (if it is please delete just this post), but it seems i am not alone anyway and it's been mentioned before.. i read a thread from a couple of weeks ago.. http://www.rovertech.net/forum/viewtopi ... +j+designs

I placed an order back in mid november with them for samco turbo hoses for my coupe. I was told they would take up to three months to be delivered, which seemed a long time but i accepted it because they could order me in just the two hoses i wanted which would cost less (i didn't need the air filter to turbo hose).

They debited the cost immediately though on 20th november, i didn't think they were supposed to do that until the goods were ready?

Anyway the hoses had not been sent by the end of the three months. I emailed the guy and he said he'd chase up. This went on for several weeks with him saying he'd chase them up etc... but it got to april and i had by then given up hope of ever receiving them!

So i emailed him and he said he agreed i'd be better off getting them from elsewhere as samco weren't delivering. I emailed him back asking therefore for a refund. However after that i heard nothing. I have tried calling, but no reply and no answer.

In the end (well end of april/early may) i called my credit card company for them to sort it out, and they suspended the payment. However i have just received a letter from them saying they can't refund the payment as it was over four months after the date it was debited when i asked for the refund.

So what do i do now? The credit card company can't help, and i can't contact the company involved. I am going to write them a letter and send it recorded delivery asking for the refund, but other than that what options do i have - small claims court? Would it be worth it for the amount involved (less than a hundred)?

Any advice would be much appreciated. It's not a fortune but it has pee'd me off quite a bit really!!

many thanks
Richard.

karmatik · Post by **karmatik** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:04 pm

Im out of pocket too and very annoyed. Have not had any replies to emails. Im not sure how to sort this out.

I think it would be a good idea for you to edit the post title to MJ Designs - might get a quicker response from moderators.

Post by **IrishRover** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:07 pm

Sorry to hear about this. It doesn't sound good for MJdesigns.
Karmatik, aren't you waiting on your suspension from them?
You pretty much can't use your car until you get that, right?

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:10 pm

Yeh i wasn't sure whether i should mention the company name directly when writing about a complaint. So i just put a link in to the earlier post about it.

There must be quite a number of people out of pocket due to this company, judging by the earlier posts (and i did a search on google which showed it had been suspended from another forum due to complaints).

This is a shame as n the past I had bought something from them with no problems, and the person i spoke to/emailed was always very helpful and polite (even with regards to this latest order). But what it comes down to is that we have payed for goods we have not received, which is plainly unnacceptable.

daz500 · Post by **daz500** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:17 pm

The credit card may not be able to give you a refund because of the time delay but they should be taking MJ to court to get your money back. Have you been able to speak to someone at the credit card company and not just rely on email communications ?

Companies are not meant to take money until the goods are ready to ship. However, as lots of companies don't keep a big stock they sometimes take the money to ensure they don't get stuck with stock if the customer changes their mind 1/2 way through the process.

Get yourself a solicitor if the credit card company still refuses to help. Perhaps other 'customers' can share the costs to help retrieve their money at the same time?

darren

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:18 pm

Just reading about small claims courts.. http://www.bbc.co.uk/crime/law/smallclaimscourt.shtml

I am going to send them a letter first but if it don't hear back from them within a reasonable time i am going to look into that.. basically whatever it takes to get the money back, i'm not going to just forget about it.

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:29 pm

I spoke to the credit card co earlier as i received their letter this morning.

They said it had been over four months after the payment was taken
therefore they could not assist. However they said if i had some proof that a refund was due (even a printout of an email) then they would do it.

The last email I had from MJD said that he thought samco were taking too long and i'd be better off getting the parts from elsewhere, so i emailed him back asking for a refund. But didn't receive a reply to that. So its not really direct proof that they were offering a refund i guess (i printed that email and sent it to the credit co when they asked me to send them documentary proof, so i guess it wasn't enough).

Not sure we are classed as "customers" (that means you give money and get something in return??) - i think "victims" would be more appropriate!

But yes if everyone who has lost money could say so on this thread then perhaps we can start a discussion as to the best way to go about getting our cash back.

I could change the post title to include the company name if you think that will be okay with the moderators. How do i edit the title name anyway?

Steve B · Post by **Steve B** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:06 pm

daz500 wrote:Companies are not meant to take money until the goods are ready to ship.

darren

Sorry but that is not correct, retailers can take the money when you order the goods, as they will see you ordering the goods, and them having to purchase them on your behalf, as a valid sale.

If you then no longer want the goods, some people will charge you a restocking fee, but for those goods ordered in as special, the retailer does not even have to refund you any money.

In this case it is different, Samco are quoting upwards of 14 weeks for hoses, and it could be that the hoses are not ready yet. They should refund you the money really as it has been longer than this agreed period. I am not defending the company mentioned, but they are reliant on the suppliers meeting the quoted times as well, and I can assure you this does not happen all of the time.

Steve

daz500 · Post by **daz500** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:08 pm

I'd say start a dedicated thread to get names of other 'victims' and it will also give MJ a chance to reply on the forum.

His account has been suspended on scoobynet :roll:

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:33 pm

Ok some fair points there, thanks.

Point taken about suppliers possibly letting down or delaying. Though it has been 6 months in my case, when they quoted up to 3 - so i think i'm right to ask for my money back. And it sounds like this has happened to many people on a range of goods, not just on samco items.

karmatik · Post by **karmatik** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:09 pm

RikK - to change post title, go to "view your posts", then click on edit in that post, its in the top right corner.

IrishRover - yes Im waiting on MTM springs and yes my car is pretty undriveable until I receive the goods I paid for.

I will not stand for this company being defended. They are an absolute disgrace. If I didnt live overseas I would be paying this guy a personal visit, and he can stick the money up his a*s. Its the principal of the whole thing, he has ripped us off and he has been calculated. This aint no innocent mix up. I have been in correspondance with the guy for 4 months and he led me on all the way until he got the money.

Post by **SubCat001** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:14 pm

Steve B wrote:Samco are quoting upwards of 14 weeks for hoses, and it could be that the hoses are not ready yet.

True Steve but in this case its over 6 months!! There no excuse for not instantly refunding or offering an alternative offer. I realise this can often be beyond the retailers control..but it doesn't make for good business if the customer is disatisfied

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:20 pm

Right thanks, i've changed the title. It's not like we are making unfair criticism of the company anyway, i've given every opportunity for them to deliver the goods or make a refund.

But if the moderators are not happy about the post they are free to alter or delete it.

I agree this is an absolute disgrace. (Fortunately) I have never dealt with a company as bad as this, where they basically take your money and don't deliver or refund.

Grant620 · Post by **Grant620** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:26 pm

I agree this is cr4p.
However - in the case of Samco - I've had stuff on order for 5 months now with Samco directly!!! They are useless...

Steve B · Post by **Steve B** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:32 pm

SubCat001 wrote:
Steve B wrote:Samco are quoting upwards of 14 weeks for hoses, and it could be that the hoses are not ready yet.

True Steve but in this case its over 6 months!! There no excuse for not instantly refunding or offering an alternative offer. I realise this can often be beyond the retailers control..but it doesn't make for good business if the customer is disatisfied

I agree, and I did say that in this case the money should be refunded. I was only stating the case with regards to Samco, as just as Grant has said they are very slow with deliveries at the mo, and it can make retailers look very bad. I am just glad we don't deal with them.

Steve

karmatik · Post by **karmatik** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:35 pm

So does anybody know if MJ Designs is "operating" now? I have a car I cant drive and I dont fancy forking out more cash whilst waiting for stuff I have paid for to arrive.

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:58 pm

A bit of useful info (I hope!) for anyone interested:

Shopping from home rights
When shopping from home you additionally have the right to:

clear information before placing an order
written information about a purchase
a 'cooling off' period during which an order can be cancelled without any reason and a full refund made
and here's the interesting one ...
a full refund if goods or services are not provided by an agreed date or within 30 days of placing an order if no date was agreed
protection against credit card fraud.

http://www.oft.gov.uk/Consumer/Your+Rig ... rights.htm

I am of course assuming this was mail order ...

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 5:21 pm

I think it partly depends on how much the goods were worth, from what i've read on several websites.. e.g. http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/lif ... esoncredit

"If the goods or services were bought by credit card, credit card cheque, trading check or with credit arranged by the supplier and the value was below Â£100, the supplier is responsible. If the goods or services are valued between Â£100 and Â£30,000 both creditor and supplier are responsible "

Mine was less than a Â£100 so legally the supplier is responsible. If people have ordered stuff more than a Â£100 maybe the situation is a bit different, seems to depend on how long ago it was ordered too (barclaycard told me 4 months is their limit for refunds. (which does seem odd)).

180 Boy · Post by **180 Boy** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 5:28 pm

I suggest you have a quick word with Trading Standards, this is what they are there for,
http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/

Iâ€™m sure they will be able to help, Iâ€™ve had dealings with them in the past and I must say they where an enormous help, there was no heated exchanges between my self and the company involved in fact I still do business with that company and I put this down at to the people at TS dealing with the case.

180 Boy

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 5:49 pm

Right i'll give that a go, looks interesting, thanks for that.

Grant620 · Post by **Grant620** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 6:43 pm

I've just left a message on his Answer machine.
I know it's a long shot - but he could have had an accident, or some sort of disaster...

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 6:47 pm

Right okay thanks for that, much appreciated.
Though i won't hold out too much hope.. i have left a message for him to call a while ago, and earlier today..

Bjorn · Post by **Bjorn** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 6:51 pm

lisa phoned both his numbers a week ago and left messages on both - still no reply!

daz500 · Post by **daz500** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 7:04 pm

I see his banner has been removed from the site.

Who's getting that space now then ?

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 7:23 pm

maybe he's taken a swift flight out of the country, he could be taking it easy in Rio or somewhere at this very moment laughing at us, i know with that many creditors i wouldn't want to stick around!
(sorry just trying to make us feel better(?!).

220TC · Post by **220TC** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 7:40 pm

I believe he was trying to sell his cosworth on passionford.com a little while ago, I dont think he's had it long so maybee he's run into a bit of financial trouble. I did have an e mail from him about stickers on the 7th May if thats any help to anyone, just trying to shed some light on the situation really

Duncan

Grant620 · Post by **Grant620** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 7:59 pm

daz500 wrote:I see his banner has been removed from the site.

Who's getting that space now then ?

Eventually - GBE, Paint Wizards on Rotation.

220TC · Post by **220TC** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 8:10 pm

MJ Designs has been posting on passionford over the last couple of days so it seems he is about, maybee try registering on there and PM'ing him or something.

Ish · Post by **Ish** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:41 pm

he last posted on passionford at 6.16pm yesterday (31.05.04) so is still around!

i have pm'd him the link to this post!

Dave400 · Post by **Dave400** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:56 pm

I had an email from him in response to one I had sent 2 weeks prior on the 29th if that helps.

Post by **SubCat001** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 12:06 am

Steve B wrote: I agree, and I did say that in this case the money should be refunded. I was only stating the case with regards to Samco, as just as Grant has said they are very slow with deliveries at the mo, and it can make retailers look very bad. I am just glad we don't deal with them.

Steve

\
No worries Steve sorry if sounded like it was in anyway directed towards you.

It seems all to exceptable for modified car owners to wait silly amounts of time for goods. Imagine if this had been a television or a pair of shoes??

Rover220CoupeTurbo · Post by **Rover220CoupeTurbo** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 9:24 am

I am sure I had an e-mail from him the other day about an item on ebay....

Aaron

Ish · Post by **Ish** » Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:12 pm

well he has 100% received my pm on passionford as it is gone out of my outbox!!

RikK · Post by **RikK** » Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:59 pm

Hi,
Right I thought i should let you know the following.. i sent a letter by recorded delivery to MJD a couple of days ago, basically saying that I'd ordered these on whatever date and demanding a refund.

I just got a very polite email back from Gareth at MJD apologising for the poor service and saying he will get a refund to my c/card as soon as possible. So assuming that goes through okay, it seems that they are honest, but have just had some sort of difficulties. Hopefully they can get whatever problems resolved as in the past i had heard good things of MJD and Gareth was always very polite and helpful in his emails.

I am changing the title of this post accordingly.. at the time i wrote it i was a bit annoyed, but it seems he was not ripping me off maliciously but just has had problems, or whatever..

cheers
Richard